New Japan only CD/DVD set coming soon

[crazysugarboy]

Originally Posted by holden

Ouch! Tell us how you really feel!

Like all art, if you don't "get it" it's easy to call it pretentious.
I mean, you could make a case that bloating "dark and Long" EP with 20+ minute self-indulgent remixes is pretentious. And the artwork of STITI? Child's fingerp
(by the way, can anyone confirm if "Parc" is really based on the live recording of "darc" from amsterdam? Or is it a new studio recording?)

To each their own, i guess.

I agree holden. I don't "get" the dark images of the booklet but that's not to say say that that I don't like the individual images. At the end of the day, Rick, Karl, and John W (and all he other Tomato guys) have been to art college, and so they know a whole lot more about art than us philistines. However, as a craftsman, I recognise what a beautiful creation the "..bells, the bells" packaging is.

Having the Amsterdam live original on the commy, I can confirm 99.9% that it is the original, with the audiance sounds erased, and the lovely spoken bits taken out :-( , except "cruel and tender...like a spider on my skin"

[negative1]

doesn't anyone think its weird the disparity
between the artistic commercial releases,
and 'book of jams' which are amazing?

don't you think the live radio shows have bits
of brilliant tracks, creative efforts from the band?
compared to the by the numbers mixes we hear?

dont' you wonder what the disconnect between
commercial releases and online (and sometimes
free) projects are?

i stand by my review 100%, for what it is, no more,
no less....do i tell people to stay away from the excellent
'book of jam' releases? (which suprisingly few people
talk about)...didn't i comment on each video
as it was released good/bad?

yeah, uw puts it stamp of approval on what gets out,
and what is released of course......but there's a reason
this is an exclusive japan only release, and
you would hope for better...if people want to know
what they're getting (and i did), and spend their
hard earned money on this, its only fair that a variety
of opinions are voiced over it...did i claim mine was
authoritative? no, i'm just one voice among many
(and i'm not the only negative one)..

by the way holden, previous underworld releases,
had their time and place, and impact....dont you think
they would want to maintain, and keep up to the standard
they set?

later
-1

[big screen satellite]

right - if there is an authority on this, then its me - being the (still) number one super fan

i have stopped buying UW in bulk, but still buy the main releases on 'commercial' CD's (just the one copy these days, mind) and seriously this is the best packaged set i have - the gatefold card sleeve is excellent - the design is wonderful

it is ceratinly worth it - and much better than the 'special edition' digipack Beaucoup Fish CD set (which is prone to ripping) and better than the Epecial Edition 1992-2002 set, which also had 'deluxe' style packaging

its certainly not pretentious - unless, which, like some people consider - all art is pretentious... yes the pictures are dark, but that's the imagry they used - i love the graphics and set up of the entire package - and i'm no art critic

the DVD's are new - in terms of - we don't have many videos in DVD form anywhere - so thats a breakthrough i feel - i like the idea of having a hard copy version of these music / movie / art pieces

the remixes may not be everyone's cup of tea, but this is the 2000's not the 90's and remixers, and club sounds have moved on. Steve Hall has picked a good choice of 'up and coming' and different remixers for this set and well they work (in parts).

I'm not going to say i like all the remixes, but play them loud and in a club and they rock.... how many of you people get out and hear these remixers in clubs? I'm really begining to enjoy all of the Ring Road mixes now... they are MY cup of tea...

yeah some people don't like this set, and for the casual viewer / listener its probably not for them, but if you are a fan of Underworld - its certainly worth buying - i'd say if it wasn't - depends on your wallet i suppose - i'd personally rather have the hard copy in lush packaging than the mp3's of this anyday

Underworld are still doing it their way and are still innovating - they are still certainly the best act (collective) in electronica and dance music - no one comes close (especially after so long at the top)

i'm still a big fan - but that doesn't distort my opinion on this release - i really do like it....

if we're marking it out of 5 - it gets four from me

[crank]

i just want to know when aNt is going to get his arse in gear and get the webstore fully functional so us gits in the rest of the world can get our grubs on them without paying an arm and a leg...

for the love of pete! aNt lets have at it!

[holden]

Originally Posted by negative1

doesn't anyone think its weird the disparity
between the artistic commercial releases,
and 'book of jams' which are amazing?

don't you think the live radio shows have bits
of brilliant tracks, creative efforts from the band?
compared to the by the numbers mixes we hear?

dont' you wonder what the disconnect between
commercial releases and online (and sometimes
free) projects are?

i stand by review 100%, for what it is, no more,
no less....do i tell people to stay away from the excellent
'book of jam' releases? (which suprisingly few people
talk about)...didn't i comment on each video
as it was released good/bad?

yeah, uw puts it stamp of approval on what gets out,
and what is released of course......

by the way holden, previous underworld releases,
had their time and place, and impact....dont you think
they would want to maintain, and keep up to the standard
they set?

That's your subjective opinion and you're right to stand by it. But i think you're mixing apples and oranges.

Agree that the artwork of the Books of Jam is probably more compelling that the Bells package. But it's also about format and audience. BoJ are larger format collections, which automatically look better on your larger screen than a 4.75"x4.75" CD liner (or whatevert the gatefold's page dimension is). BoJ is loaded with images, some good, some less interesting...one can clutch onto what they like from the large choice, discard the rest, whereas the comparatively few images of the gatefold are permanent and unavoidable.
BoJ is free and downloaded (i'd suppose) primarily by the hardcore fans. In them, they can do whatever they want. theBells is also a niche purchase (regional or import), but is not necessarily the format for artistic experiments.

As for the radio shows, yes, UW have unveiled some snippets of tracks that sound very interesting. They've also played some pieces which frankly sound unfinished or wouldn't appeal to some for a commercial release. And then, we all go gaa-gaa for tracks like Bamboo, ALaF, 020202...fact is these songs have been floating around for years without completion or release. Further, how can you compare the "by the numbers" mixes by DIFFERENT PRODUCERS with Underworld's own tracks? BigScreen addresses this above. Apples and oranges, my friend.

The disconnect between free and commercial output is simple: audience and intent. Some things are not ready for broad release or wouldn't appeal to the whole fan base. In the free releases, they can do whatever, shoot a lot of arrows, see which stick. Commercial releases cost money to produce (duh) and have a lot more hands on the product from labels, producers, distributors...more restrictions and more need for focusing to consumers.

As for your comment about previous releases having their time and place and impact...yeah? That's true of EVERY release by EVERY artist...it had an impact on someone. Bands change, no one likes every song a particular band made (if they say they do, they're probably lying!). If you don't dig their latest phase, fine. That's no reason to suspect that they've dipped in quality by not reaching the "standard" you've set for them. I've said it before, paraphrasing R&K...OWB is the album they wanted to make for a long while and (my opinion) it's certainly more cohesive that AHDO or perhaps even BF.

Their output in all forms since 2005 or so has been nothing short of prolific and incredibly generous. In my eyes, we've been treated to a luxury of having so much music and art to discuss and critique here, which is fun and is certainly better than having nothing new (a la 2000-AHDO, AHDO - RiverRun).

[BrotherLovesDub]

Originally Posted by negative1

doesn't anyone think its weird the disparity
between the artistic commercial releases,
and 'book of jams' which are amazing?

don't you think the live radio shows have bits
of brilliant tracks, creative efforts from the band?
compared to the by the numbers mixes we hear?

dont' you wonder what the disconnect between
commercial releases and online (and sometimes
free) projects are?

i don't see a disconnect/disparity, i take them all for what they are meant to be. each avenue/channel has it's own value to the fan/listener/collector but few bands have given the fans such a wealth of material to digest, most of it for free. i'm not sure why you are having such a hard time with remixes other people have done for UW. i could give a shit about the remixes. i'm not an underworld fan to see how some other fool can rework their songs. those mixes are for club play. as far as what Rick, Karl and Darren have done with the music they've created live and in the studio for the last 3 years or so, i think it includes the best music to have Underworld's name on it. Tomato have done a great job with the live visuals and artwork for the releases/book of jams. videos don't mean shit to me and haven't since i eagerly awaited Duran Duran's new video (Union of the Snake) way back in the day. i was left disappointed by that, and haven't really given a shit about that particular promotional tool since.

i picked up Boy Boy Boy cd single, Oblivion Ball and The Bells, The Bells from the post office today and couldn't be happier.

[big screen satellite]

i have personally seen the club reaction details for this release and know for a fact that the remixes of Ring Road are the best UW have received for a long while - the fake blood mix is currently 'tearing up dance floors'

i think some of you people need to get out in the clubs / (festival) tents and see how these mixes are going down with the crowds - who actually listen to dance music week in week out....

i don't even think its about shifting units, its how popular Underworld are in terms of reaction and bums on seats in terms of live perfomances - these are what Underworld enjoy most and probably make most money doing - Underworld are at a peak, in a more rapidly changing dance arena than has ever been - if UW can make a track at the begining of the 90's like mmm skyscraper, and 16 years later make a track like Ring Road (or more differently Beautiful Burnout) then i commend them....

again, as i have said i am a big fan, but i truly belive this period in Underworld's existence is one of their best and most creative - keep it coming

in the 00's sadly people want instant gratification - and the next new thing on the horizon arrives before the current thing has expired - at least underworld are fresh now as they ever were...

[BrotherLovesDub]

.

The Bells, The Bells

[BeautifulBurnout]

Originally Posted by BrotherLovesDub

.

The Bells, The Bells

LMFAO!

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I just find that sometimes the opinions are so negative about just about everything that is released or broadcast for free (side bar: yes, I have a long memory and remember only too well the comment about the Misterons mix at Christmas and how we shouldn't be thanking the band for giving us FOR FREE something that they ought to be doing all the time ) that I really dismiss the dissing outright while barely bothering to read it.

If one wants to be stuck in the early 90s, so be it. I, for one, find that Underworld have grown, metamorphosed and progressed with the times to develop into a band that still has their finger on the pulse. But that is only my opinion.

[BrotherLovesDub]

Originally Posted by BeautifulBurnout

Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

yes. i agree. everyone is entitled to their opinion. as i stated before, i appreciate what negative 1 has contributed to this forum and NOOL and would consider the darktrain forums to be at a loss without his contributions. my pic was meant to be funny, not hurtful. just wanted to clarify.