Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

This track is properly stuck in my head now :)

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

I'm split on the content, Iggy's over-the-top delivery makes it sound quite self-aware to me. Almost as if he's taking the piss out of the kind of person who'd quite seriously have this kind of rant. But I agree that it's still a bit tasteless.

Backing track and Karl's vocals are superb.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

At first I was very indifferent towards it, but I've come around quite a lot and Iggy's verbal tirade is no longer grating on me either. But it's mainly due to that beat. Bloody hell Mr Smith, you can still knock em out of the park when you want.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

Anyone got a link to that interview? Thanks.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0b48zq7

About the 1:15:00 mark.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

Cheers!

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

This is available for purchase on Qobuz now, including in 24-bit. I imagine it will appear on 7digital shortly, which is slightly cheaper, the same way Brilliant Yes That Would Be did.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

I picked up the 24 bit from Qobuz. I frigging love Qobuz. #1 digital music store for me, followed by Bandcamp. Underworld should just create their own Bandcamp to be honest.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

They had their own digital fulfillment store created by ant in 2005-2010 or so. It wasn't that great. They really don't have the resources to build and maintain their own e-commerce solution. They already have digital fulfillment through their TM Stores shop platform. They just don't use it much, though I don't know why.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

I’ve never understood this about Underworld. There are so many simple ways to monetize the vast amount of stuff they’ve already released for free and made unavailable.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

That's why they seriously need a Bandcamp store. That way they can just upload the music and let Bandcamp handle the rest. No costs in building or maintaining anything. They seriously should just reissue their entire catalog digitally thru Bandcamp. Bandcamp has various formats as well as streaming capabilities.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

I'd re-buy Riverrun through bandcamp just to be supportive of it being available again.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

Yeah, Bandcamp is completely ideal for this kind of thing. Upload tracks and art and it's done.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

whew, a lot has been said about this track already, but it's quickly becoming one of my favourites from the band. iggy pop's input was a bit intriguing on the first listen, but after extensive plays, i now don't mind it at all. karl's catchy refrain really gets stuck into your head and the backing track is an absolute stomper. an awesome treat to your ears!

i hope underworld continues to make more songs in this similar vein. all the energy from this single track makes me very excited for whatever else they have prepared for the World of Underworld. in fact, there'll likely be another similar stomping track coming soon, which i cannot wait for... :D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rESIZcMbaqs

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

really? really really? :P

After more listens i really love the music but hate the rant even more. chorus has grown me a bit however. i can't help but picture Ted Nugent when Iggy is ranting.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

yes really! i just can't get over it
what's interesting about this track is how controversial the discussion about it has been. many here either dislike iggy's adult ranting (i do find it a bit odd that underworld now have associations in a song that references drugs.. weren't they quite cautious about their music being linked to such things in the past?), or are rather fine with it.. and i'm in the latter ;)

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

yeah i hear ya. the rant just feels really cheap to me. and well, ranty.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

I agree. Second part of the rant is lees internering then the stewardess part but the song just builds up the way I love from the band. It has something from Dark and Long drive and the vocals are like moanerisk (is this a thing?). They should release a version with Karl doing the full vocals 😀

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

actually the stewardess bit didn't really register as problematic to me at all. what rubs me the wrong way is how banal iggy's rant is. like - you used to be able to smoke on a plane, and now you can't? that's it? is this supposed to be some kind of elegy for the 70s when you could be as insensitive as you wanted without repercussions? cause that's a bit suspect coming from someone famous and privileged enough to have enjoyed self-indulgence with impunity during a decade that was really shitty for a lot of other kinds of people. and if its supposed to be self-parody of rock-star ego well then its just too subtle to register and that's entirely the fault of the creators. there's no give-away that leads us to that interpretation.

the best underworld tracks have lyrics that are oblique, poetic, nonsensical, and slyly profound, and this offers none of that. but the production is decent enough I suppose, so not a total waste of time.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

So would I. Hell, I'll rebuy their entire discogs if they made it all available digitally.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

Well someone brought up the word "sexist" so that's what I responded to.
Anyway, of course everyone is entitled to their opinion and it's always fun to try and dissect Underworld tracks.
For me the track, or at least Iggy's part is about having fun, doing what you want, being perhaps a bit rebellious. All these things should not be alien to people immersed in dance-music culture like us Underworld fans. Hedonism and escapism was always a big part of that. He speaks about more things than just the smoking on the airplane but I actually like how he zooms in on this banal detail when he remembers having fun, feeling good back in his day, and contrasting this with perhaps today, where some of these things are no longer possible (smoking on the airplane) or at least frowned upon (hitting on a stewardess).
Obviously UW saw that too, hence the repetition of the phrases "Smoking on the airplane" and "You can't do that".

It's not like UW's lyrics don't often do the same thing. "Lager lager lager"... Karl loves to zoom in on banal little details of the world, and in the context of the music they take on different meanings. Of course where Karl's lyrics came from a darker place, at least back then, Iggy here seems to recall details of those days with some fondness.

Well, which part do you find "insensitive"? Smoking was not considered as bad as it is today back in the 70's. As he says in the track: "everyone was doing it". Also, I'm sure every decade has been really shitty for some group of people but what does that have to do with anything? While we are dancing our asses off to Underworld, other people in the world have nothing to eat. You, me, all of us here are priviliged in the extreme compared to most other people in the world. Are we then not supposed to enjoy our lives anymore? I'm sure Iggy worked hard for his success and fame and loads of people love his music. And he probably has had enough difficult times as well (remember Lust for Life is about fighting heroin addiction) so who are we to judge the guy's "privilige". As far as I'm concerned he can do whatever he wants to make himself feel good as long as it doesn't come at the direct detriment to other people.

I don't think it's a self parody. I think he's genuine. He's not taking himself too seriously, but that's not the same as parody. Of course all these big rock star types turn into a bit of a parody of themselves at some point (if they survive long enough), but that's part of why people like rock stars I guess. They're supposed to be larger than life.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

idk I'm not really bothered by Iggy's rant. I think it's supposed to be wistful and a little sad. dude has lived the ultimate rock star life and now he is reminiscing about...uh...not being able to smoke on the airplane. like the "you can't do that" part comes off to me like...no shit you can't do that!! besides hasn't Underworld's aesthetic always been a bit grimy and inconsequential? beauty in trash, etc. etc.


this track goes super hard. I'm impressed. I love a lot of what they've done these last 20 years (!!!!) but god damn, it feels good to get a proper banger again

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

Actually this is a fair point, so thanks. I think I'm just more likely to be charitable to Karl's vocals because I get a sense of what kind of person he is (based on interviews, previous work, etc.) and he's always come across as thoughtful & likeable. Whereas Iggy has mostly just comes across as petulant and tiresome to me. So I guess that's just my bias. I do agree though that Iggy's rant isn't entirely out of place in the Underworld universe.

I suppose I raise an eyebrow any time anyone gets a little misty-eyed about more "permissive" decades of the recent past. Like, didn't Mad Men teach us anything? Sure the furniture was cool but a lot of the rest of it was pretty gross. I'm old enough (though, not as old as Iggy) to remember when you could smoke everywhere and it was pretty fucking awful. I've also lost a couple of family members to lung cancer so I guess that's another personal bias. And before you go "wow you sound fun" remember that this is an Underworld forum so I guess I'm at least fun enough to like dance music. So there's that.

Anyway, thanks for your feedback. It's made me reconsider the track a little bit, though I'll probably just end up relegating it to the slowly growing list of "Underworld and Underworld adjacent tracks I never listen to" along with "The First Note Is Silent" and some of the 2012 Olympic stuff . . .

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

i think the iggy rant can live despite it coming from someone who's used to and proud of their sense of entitlement, because it successfully pulls off describing a whole perspective out of smaller parts. these are paper scraps and cig butts, what should be embarrassing metal globs of words, that somehow amount to crystallizing a much larger idea of How It Works. who's getting pranked on (in a lighter and much darker sense) vs who doing it. his idea of our ecosystem of beliefs. his ethos that emerged out of... whatever life he's lived over several decades. i'm not sure how valuable that is really ("salty white rock star muddles through their own brain to find some discontent" does not deserve to be interesting tbh), but we have a complete painting, done well, and i hope he finds someone who'll smack him on the back of the head at unexpected intervals on an ongoing basis.


i don't think i'm gonna listen to it too much though.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

i mean....


this is how a lot of underworld 'moments' happen though. the difference is that iggy uses the stream to complain and declare like a jackass, whereas karl finds his high in transcendent ambiguity, which is way classier but no less immune from being totally awkward if he doesn't stick the landing.
if iggy had excised about 33% of this rant we'd probably get something really vivid and affecting, but then it wouldn't really be iggy probably.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

isn't this exactly what he's implying?
like right on the line at the beginning.

"i'd get my finger into everything i wanted"
this natural sense that any space is his to cheerfully fuck with, his blithe right to invade anything he wants is instantly obnoxious.

his self-aggrandizing "i shouldn't have wings because of what people say about ethics i guess", because he'd do things that go against wimpy european ideas of right and wrong. that sounds pretty strongly like he believes that you're either the one doing it or the one it's being done to.



he'd have fun according to the rules of "the jungle", which will come, because the revolution won't happen. what's coming is a civilization full of atavistic degenerates, who will still ban smoking on flights, which will be hijacked by criminals running a "pretty good business." he de facto knows the rules of this jungle better then people who don't smoke.



nevermind that the jungle would brain him with a rock and sell his drug-infused bone marrow on ebay if it could, big rebel.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

The waitress part still comes off as somewhat creeper to me. It's furthered by his desire to have had the waitress instead of the cocaine as though each is a thing for him to have. I then can't disconnect the "you can't do that" from the waitress section, which doesn't help the image.


On the other hand, every female subject of Karl's lyrics comes across as a full and beautiful human being, save for perhaps, "the most blonde I ever met." I feel an earnest affection from Karl's portrayals as opposed to a self centered lust. Slummin it for the weekend is the best example of this.

I understand all the various contexts of the song and the lyrics and the writers, and at the end of the day, I just prefer Karl's writing and framing to Iggy's, I guess.

I appreciate that this band has put out a song that has sparked such legitimate discussion. I also appreciate that this forum keeps it civil.

Also it's a banging track and Karl/Esme's vocals are A1, top shelf, Underworld magic.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

Sure I get that. I'm certainly more familiar with Karl as a person (insofar as that's possible without personally knowing him) than Iggy Pop, who I only know as... well.. Iggy Pop the rock star. And perhaps the heroin addict.

Oh I'm totally with you that smoking everywhere was awful. Bars, restaurants, trains... especially on an airplane, it sounds absolutely horrible! And I've also seen an uncle and an acquaintance die from lung cancer so again, totally 100% with you that smoking is awful. Cocaine use, same thing. Another person I knew was a heavy cocaine user and committed suicide last year leaving behind a wife and two kids. Pretty tragic.

But at the same time for many people these things have at some point been sources of "fun" and enjoyment. Most if not all people have had some rebellious phase. I used to be a smoker until about 7-8 years ago (so happy I quit) and I've used various drugs including cocaine. When I was younger it was part of the scene and I was impressionable. Not every cocaine user commits suicide, not everyone who enjoys a beer becomes an alcoholic. Certainly Iggy pop has over-indulged in some of these things during his life but I'm not really hearing this so much as a celebration of over-indulgence to be followed, but just his personal experience.

Thanks for responding. I do get where you're coming from and it is not my intention to change anyone's opinion of the song, but I think it's open for different interpretations (as usual).

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

Well the stewardes (not waitress) did give him her phone number (if we take his story for truth) willingly so there seems to be mutual consent there. It's not like he was thinking of "having her" against her will right?
Self centered lust may not be the most beautiful or poetic of human emotions, but it is human and normal for everyone to have from time to time.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

Well I think you're making it sound worse than it's intended. Again, I think it should be considered more tongue-in-cheek. He's perhaps speculating on what he would do if unrestrained. He's not saying that's objectively good or moral.
It sounds like you're reading "get his finger in everything" as something sexual and invading, again implying against someone else's will. "Having your finger in (every pie)" also just means being involved, and influencing in many different things. He's just being honest about himself, it sounds like he knows he's someone who would, unrestrained, indulge in many vices. He has done that. Surely he also knows the dark side of this, which could be to the detriment of himself and others. He's already fought heroin addiction, he's had the messed up life. He's 70 now. He doesn't smoke, he does tai-chi, and lives happily with his wife in Miami. His idea of a wild time is going to the beach and to "have dinner with my wife somewhere with low lighting where we can sit close to each other."

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

i also found the play on the line "the revolution will not be televised" to just be shoved in there. how does that even fit in here? and for that matter, isnt the chorus and rant two totally different feelings?

i really dislike the Iggy Pop rant. as a one-off, sure, have at it. but if this was an album track i'd be really bummed.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

It’s not that complicated. The piece is an old white man’s eulogy for the days where he could impose his thoughtless will on other people without restraint, which is necessarily a criticism of the world of today, a world increasingly defined by a rejection of that kind of behavior on every level. I find it an entirely unsympathetic posture.

But if I’m giving Iggy too much credit insofar as making a statement about the world, then maybe the song sucks even more because then he’s just literally ranting artlessly about his yearning for the days when he could smoke on airplanes, entirely ignorant of the world in which the song finds itself? Because intentionally provocative shit is still preferable to meaningless shit.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

Totes +100 on this

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

this song, makes 'stray dog', which he did with new order, sound good.
(and i can't stand that song either).

although there, the lyrics were written by bernard sumner.

later
-1

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

That song broke my heart. I love the music in that track, but those words are dire -- even by Sumner standards. Not Iggy's fault there. My fanfiction idea for that song is what if those lyrics were delivered in the heavily distorted "Fine Time" voice, masking their substance but still sounding cool? Alas.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

well yeah, but as everyone that uses this forum, i love Underworld for their poetry thru stream of consciousness and not incredibly cheesy fake prose.

steal planes and take them to Cuba: "he had a good business" - wtf is that? SO CRINGE.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

Really? I just think it's funny.

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

eh. i think its pretty dumb. his list of rants involve smoking on the airplane (cant do that anymore), banging stewardesses (cant do that anymore), and hijacking planes (huh?)

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

I'm glad that an Underworld track has got this much attention and debate!

Since 2000, I've been a fan, and pretty much every new track has required some "getting used to". Several listens into this, and I love it. The words melt away, the important parts left are the beats, the "sunshine on my wings", and echoed "you can't do that".

Re: Bells & Circles Ft. Iggy Pop
 

He doesn't talk about 'banging stewardesses' he talks about not being brave enough to ask the stewardess for her telephone number, so her snorts a gram of Chang to gain confidence, then she gives him her phone number, but because he was so stoned, he loses her number.
He then reflects that taking the cocaine was a mistake.

There's a whole story there you're changing to suit your own projected meaning.