REQUEST: Hunting for UW Live Temptation Alexandra Palace NYE 1998 source recordings

[Badger]

I want to make a request here:

The live show from Alexandra Palace NYE 1998 is still my fav Underworld gig I have ever been to and I loved that Radio One played the whole set over two different nights but they did jumble up the play order a bit and there was also some talking over a couple of tracks.

Now I know that Jamie put together a good compilation of the tracks in the right order which is up on the RTSR tracker and I provided one of the sources for that but I have just got hold of two new DAB sources of a few tracks and there were a couple of errors in the torrent on RTSR (there is a missed bar near end of Mmm...Skyscraper, I Love You and the version of King Of Snake - used from a Swedish radio broadcast torrent - is missing about a minute edited out of the middle of the breakdown by the radio station for some unknown reason) so I was thinking of trying to put a new upgraded version together.

Now my request here is to try and source the original versions of this show that were used on the Bootleg Babies project.

Does anyone have info on how to get hold of this source? Whoever provided these for the Bootleg Babies project - they were from a very clean and great sounding source.

So - DOES ANYONE KNOW WHERE THE SOURCE WAS FOR THE ALEXANDRA PALACE SHOW THAT WAS USED FOR BOOTLEG BABIES? And would it be possible to get hold of it?

If I were able to get hold of this source then I would be able to put together a great sounding complete show.

Plus if there is anyone else out there who has good quality sources of this show from the original BBC Radio 1 broadcasts or the Swedish national radio (SR) on 14th of April 1999 then please send me a message on here or PM.

Plus also if anyone from the original Bootleg Babies project (Geoff (especially him), Yannick, -1, jason, phil, scott, adam, mike, joe t, kameron, dave, mark, michael, dean, scott, andrew, mike, the members of rtsr-trade, graham, chris beck.) could get hold of me and let me know about the NYE 98 sources even if that means telling me that the sources are not available then at least I can stop wondering where they came from as it has been a question burning at me for years.

PS - moderators please could you delete my original post.

[geoff]

Hey Badger, I'm happy to help you out on this if I can. (You can thank TheBang for grabbing my attention.) I went and dug up my old CD sources this morning. I'll take a deeper look at them maybe tonight and get back to you.

Oddly enough, I do remember one thing clearly.. that I needed to patch Skyscraper together from 2 different sources. It was a simple cross fade from one source to the next. I think the better sounding source was incomplete. Cheers!

[Badger]

Geoff you are a star! Yeah I thought I might have to do some patch work with that track but if you have the rest complete then that would be a great start. Thank you so much.

I have been wanting to do this for ages and now with the two BBC6 rips of some of the show I should be able to make a very complete good quality show that would be an upgrade to the one on the RTSR tracker.

[jetpig]

Looking forward to this. Its a fav for sure. Thanks for doing the legwork!

[Badger]

I think the editing of King Of Snake on Jamie's version may have been to edit out radio stings, but now I have a new recording of the full 17 min version of KOS.

It should be a great show once it's complete and I'm looking forward to starting on it.

[TheBang]

17 min :eek:

[Badger]

😊😉😉😎

[Badger]

It's actually almost 17 and a half minutes the complete version

[Badger]

There's an awesome massive breakdown in the middle of it where the music drops away completely and it's just Karl and his vocals before it all kicks off again. Brilliant version of KOS

[geoff]

Badger, I sent you a PM to follow up. Yes, the version of KOS is way long.. 16:08 in my copy :)

[Badger]

Here's a teaser for you guys...this is the FULL version of King Of Snake from the show...with only minor work done to it so far.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoXXjPZptTw

[Badger]

Geoff, sent you a PM with a couple of questions and some info. Cheers.

[Badger]

I will have a good source for the Swedish radio broadcast but there was some heavy editing by the Sweds on this broadcast so I am still looking for anyone who might have sources of the original Radio 1 broadcasts.

The original radio one broadcasts were:
- Annie Nightingale -
Mmm Skyscraper I Love You complete
Cowgirl
Push upstairs (Annie talked a bit in the middle of this)
Rez

- Steve Lamacq -
"Happy New Year" from Karl
King Of Snake
King Of Snake (Bungalow with "Moaner lyrics)
Dark & Long (Dark Train)
Born Slippy NUXX


I have the two radio one broadcasts which had everything just in a different order but my radio reception had a bit of static noise in the background. Was hoping to find another slightly cleaner source for the radio 1 broadcasts to make this even better but mine are good, I might be able to clean them up a little more but would be good if we could find another source.

Message me here or send me a PM if you have some sources or know someone who might have.

[stimpee]

Great work Matt!

[jetpig]

sounding REALLY good, even over youtube.

PS that picture of a snake with a crown is downright ADORABLE.

[Badger]

Am I really the ONLY one here that has the Radio One recordings? 🙁😢

[markreed]

Have a look here ; https://www.mixcloud.com/1spaceboss/underworld-new-order-live-at-the-ally-pally-london-31-dec-1998/

There are links to a 320kbps mp3 rip of this on that page.

I also have a 17 year old CDR made from the original broadcast dumped to tape. From the sound of it, the band mixed the show twice ; 1 - the raw feed which is above and 2 - a 60 minute (approx) edit broadcast in Jan 1999.

UPDATE : from what my battered memory tells me the Mixcloud stream is the full show, as it seems to be identical to what I heard on the night.

[Badger]

Hey Mark,

That mp3 on mixcloud is a rip of Jamie's version of the show that is on the RTSR tracker.

But if you are able to rip your old CDR with Exact or something and get it uploaded somewhere that would be great and could possibly help us out a bit.

[Badger]

I also have a 17 year old CDR made from the original broadcast dumped to tape. From the sound of it, the band mixed the show twice ; 1 - the raw feed which is above and 2 - a 60 minute (approx) edit broadcast in Jan 1999.


I have got one other source of the BBC broadcast which will be very helpful but it is a little compressed so if it is possible for you to rip FLACS of your CDR that would be awesome and would give me one extra source and another option when constructing this full set.

And it is going to be a bit of work with stuff from a few different sources. The main thing will be to get them sounding close enough to each other and the very good and very clean Swedish cut up broadcast. And then patching them together.

But that will be the fun part.

[Mike]

Am I right in thinking New Order also played at Ally Pally at the same night? I vaguely remember Radio 1 asking people at the gig which one they preferred and everybody pretty much said "oh yeah, Underworld were way better".

Mark: Can you check that the data is correct on these?

"Temptation I" in Manchester (I have your photos attached to this one - were these actually from Ally Pally?)
http://uwlive.rowla.com/gigs/view/126

"Temptation II" at Ally Pally
http://uwlive.rowla.com/gigs/view/127

We have recordings of both.

Edit: I see from your blog post (http://www.thefinalword.co.uk/content/view/22/34/) that you went to London gig, so I'm pretty sure those photos should be for the London gig and yes New Order also played the same night.

Quote from the gig:

K: "Hey look, i'm using autocue"

A nice reference to KoS visuals from that era.

[TheBang]

UW were supporting New Order for both nights. Temptation I in Manchester was on 12/29, and Temptation II in London was on 12/31, so the dates are wrong in the Gigography.

http://www.new-order.net/no/gigs/#1998

[Badger]

New Order did play that night on NYE but they were a bit ropey, Bernard's voice was a little hit and miss plus they played through midnight didn't know it had happened, we could all hear Sasha (I think) (EDIT UPDATE it was actually Judge Jules playing at midnight via ISDN) in the other room going off and new year seen in properly and then after the track New Order were playing finished (a couple of minutes after midnight) some roadie ran on and whispered in Bernard's ear that it had gone midnight, Bernard said "Happy New Year" without much conviction then carried on into the next song...most anti-climatic news years I've had when out.

But then Underworld came on and played my favourite set that I'd ever seen just for the amazing versions of everything and the atmosphere after New Order's wet squib of a set.

This is why I'm trying to put together a new upgraded version of the night and thanks to Mike now it will be an even more complete show. Will just hang on for a little while longer to see if we can find anymore sources for the Radio 1 broadcasts.

And when Karl said that quote "Hey look, i'm using autocue" when he was singing Moaner I thought that was just a remix of Moaner until we heard King Of Snake (Bungalow). Unique having the two of them combined that night.

[Badger]

UW were supporting New Order for both nights. Temptation I in Manchester was on 12/29, and Temptation II in London was on 12/31, so the dates are wrong in the Gigography.

http://www.new-order.net/no/gigs/#1998

Yeah the date for the first Temptation show is wrong, but technically the date for Temptation II is correct as Underworld played at 1am...so not on NYE itself but NYD. :-)

[markreed]

Hi Mike

New Order and Underworld played both nights. Chemical Brothers also played the side room at Ally Pally in London around 3am.

I was at both Manchester and London.

Manchester New Order were around 11-12.30, UW around 1.00-3.00 in Manchester

London New Order were 10.45-12.15, UW around 12.45-2.30, Chems around 3.00-5.00? in London

I was a little fucked at the end of those, though seeing the photos brings it back. On NYE New Order started late and had some tech problems, it was intended that “Temptation” would end around 11.58, countdown to midnight, then a big encore of Blue Monday/Fine Time as first songs of 1999. In the end “Temptation” hadn't finished at midnight.

I'd love to get a recording of the Manchester show ;)

I'll see if I can FLAC the CDR, but as I remember, this was in the days of 1GB hard drives, so I probably ripped the tape to MP3. Can't remember now 17 years later. Don't be surprised if its an MP3 source. If you still want it, I'll see if I can find it though it's probably no different from any core source you already have.

Photos are from Manchester, I think. There's a shot of Manchester crowd at the end of “Born Slippy” on everythingeverything DVD – it's the circular hockey bowl type area.

(There's also an indoor shot of Wolves at the end of Born Slippy on EE).

[markreed]

Whilst i remember, and this is spoddy,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kutf1Ra-BDM

1.03.19-21 on this looks like Wolves to me.

[Mike]

I'd love to get a recording of the Manchester show ;)

Thanks for all the info Mark. The Manchester show is actually on the tracker (https://tracker.rtsr.org/torrents-details.php?id=209).

There is a fantastic guitar improvisation between Push and Rowla. :p

[TheBang]

Yeah the date for the first Temptation show is wrong, but technically the date for Temptation II is correct as Underworld played at 1am...so not on NYE itself but NYD. :-)
But for the purposes of cataloging the gig dates consistently, you put it down for the date that the event started, regardless of what time the act actually went on. There have been plenty of gigs where UW go on after midnight, but you don't put it down for the next day.

Even the lanyard you posted is proof of that. It says "New Year's Eve 1998" not "New Year's Day 1999" :)

[markreed]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kutf1Ra-BDM

53:36 is Wolverhampton Civic Hall
1.03.19-21 is Manchester

I was there. :)

[Badger]

Yeah I always thought it should be 31.12.98 but thought that the info on there was fairly good so thought a decision had been made to make it 1.1.99. I didn't want to upset anyone saying it should be 31.12.98. ��

[Badger]

On NYE New Order started late and had some tech problems, it was intended that “Temptation” would end around 11.58, countdown to midnight, then a big encore of Blue Monday/Fine Time as first songs of 1999. In the end “Temptation” hadn't finished at midnight.

Now if that had happened that would've been a great way to bring in the new year!

[Badger]

Any joy with the CDR Mark?

[TheBang]

Now if that had happened that would've been a great way to bring in the new year!

Of course, there's always the way Underworld rings in the New Year:

AuVNzInsb5Q

[Badger]

Yeh I was there for that one too...10 years on from the Temptation night. And my second favourite Underworld show.

[TheBang]

Yeh I was there for that one too...20 years on from the Temptation night. And my second favourite Underworld show.
Pretty sure it was only 10 years ;)

[Badger]

That's what happens when you post slightly drunk in the middle of the night...DOH!

[robotusch]

But for the purposes of cataloging the gig dates consistently, you put it down for the date that the event started, regardless of what time the act actually went on. There have been plenty of gigs where UW go on after midnight, but you don't put it down for the next day.
A bit like the two gigs at Roskilde Festival 1996 (if the friday one ever happened as described, I'd be mighty amused), where they're shown as having played well after midnight on both friday & saturday.

[TheBang]

A bit like the two gigs at Roskilde Festival 1996 (if the friday one ever happened as described, I'd be mighty amused), where they're shown as having played well after midnight on both friday & saturday.
They played both days:

https://www.borndirty.org/forums/showthread.php?p=62820#post62820

[robotusch]

I know they were scheduled to play both days (Friday 3 AM & Saturday at midnight), I'm just having a hard time imagining Underworld mk2 doing an Underworld mk1-style gig.

[TheBang]

Oh. According to jose m in that post, they played the same style set both times.

[Badger]

I'll see if I can FLAC the CDR, but as I remember, this was in the days of 1GB hard drives, so I probably ripped the tape to MP3. Can't remember now 17 years later. Don't be surprised if its an MP3 source. If you still want it, I'll see if I can find it though it's probably no different from any core source you already have.


Any luck with the CDR of the set yet Mark?

[markreed]

Sorry Badger, not yet. I looked in the box I thought it was in at the weekend (it wasn't), so I have to go to Plan B and look in The Other Boxes Under The Bed. :)

[Badger]

That's cool Mark. Just give me a shout when you've had a look under the bed and hopefully found it.

[Badger]

Any luck with the cd Mark?

[ndrwrld]

i just found this on Soulseek.
13 tracks...
pearls girl, improv, cups, slippy, improv, push upstairs, improv, rowla, please help me, nuxx, bluce lee, king of snake.
recorded @ 160.

currently queued...should have it tonight.

[Mike]

i just found this on Soulseek.
13 tracks...
pearls girl, improv, cups, slippy, improv, push upstairs, improv, rowla, please help me, nuxx, bluce lee, king of snake.
recorded @ 160.

currently queued...should have it tonight.

Thats the Manchester gig that is already available on the rtsr tracker (https://tracker.rtsr.org/torrents-details.php?id=209)!

http://uwlive.rowla.com/gigs/view/126

[Badger]

i just found this on Soulseek.
13 tracks...
pearls girl, improv, cups, slippy, improv, push upstairs, improv, rowla, please help me, nuxx, bluce lee, king of snake.
recorded @ 160.

currently queued...should have it tonight.

Yeah, I'm putting together a new London show. Just going to get hold of one more source then I'm going to start work on it.

[Badger]

Bumping this up again as I'm trying to get back to work on it.
Think I was still waiting for one more source from Mark Reed.

Have sent you a private message Mark.

Also bumping in case anyone new has any sources for this after my original request.

[Badger]

Just a question if the end section of Mmm, Skyscraper, before Cowgirl, at Temptation, Alexandra Palace, NYE 1998 actually is a recognized jam and has a title or if its just Rick messing with the end of Skyscraper/start of Cowgirl?

It's from about 9 minutes/10 minutes (depending) into Skyscraper and last for about 4-5 minutes before Cowgirl starts properly.

Here's the track for people to have a listen to to see if anyone can help with info (watch at 9 minutes):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bduYXWTSJI4

[TheBang]

Nothing I recognize, sorry.

Also, did you know that 8:50 - 11:00 in that clip is in mono?

[Badger]

I didn't but I am having a deep look at each of my sources before i start construction of my new version of the Temptation show to make sure things are as good as they can be.

The source of the youtube clip is Jamie's mixdown of the show (that is up on the RTSR tracker).

Skyscraper is going to be one of the biggest pain in the asses as it will probably have to be constructed from 3 - 4 different sources to get the best and most complete full version possible (the Swedish radio source is missing a couple of minutes of the start and is missing the few minutes of the jam type part of the end and has a glitch in it and the other sources have issues too but i think i might have one full radio 1 recording that is good so maybe we wont have a multi source version that might sound uneven...havent decided yet.)

Skyscraper will be the hardest fix out of all the tracks from the show.

[WhiteNoise]

For a moment the jam is "Synth Attack", just a nickname for those fast bright chords which they played more than a few times in 98/99. Not as long as usual, most of it is just beat improv.

[Badger]

Is it worth labelling it as that and track marking it? Or just leave it as Skyscraper?

[WhiteNoise]

I probably wouldn't label it and definitely not index it. It's so short.

[Yannick]

if I remember correctly the complete show source was from a cd-r I got from the bbc archive

[Badger]

Yannick is that the mono low quality one? Just because that was the way it was recorded?

[Yannick]

Yannick is that the mono low quality one? Just because that was the way it was recorded?

yeah that was the one, I guess it was a mishap on their side. I dont have the cd anymore tho, been lost in all my random move and escape.

[Badger]

Thats cool Yannick...Mike was able to give me a copy and we've used it as a MASTER GUIDELINE for my editing in the timeline and also for the little missing bits off of Skyscraper at the start and the full start of Rez. Added some ambience from a reverb plug to make it sound a little more stereo and then layered crowd underneath.

Always was annoyed that no broadcast ever played the full version of Rez.

Here is a little preview of full "Rez"...its not the final final version but it might give you an idea of what we've done...
Let me know what you think so far...although it's only a little taste of whats coming.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjzIeAu1ijE

[Badger]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjzIeAu1ijE

[Lx_Nen]

That is rather lovely!

[jetpig]

I find that crowd noise has been the best determiner of how a set is gonna sound in comparison to other sets from a fidelity point of view, and from the moment I hit play there was a HUGE difference. Good work! Can't wait to hear the whole thing!

[Badger]

Here's something to show what a bit of a jigsaw puzzle getting this show together is...

this is the construction of Skyscraper ...but i will tell you Skyscraper is the worse track that we had to piece together for the whole show..

https://scontent.fmel1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/22426283_10154800764777115_7168277763317113026_o.j pg?oh=24b7d27b8da5ec0537a218b566bee46f&oe=5A737F53

[dubnobasswithme]

Will always love that slow build for Rez :D

[big screen satellite]

because of this track, this will always be my fav uw gig i attended...

oh that and Bez Dancing with New Order ;)

[Badger]

Yeah same for me Matt...best UW gig I ever went too...every version of every track that night just blew the roof off and the Slow Rez just topped it off perfectly.

[Badger]

Almost finished work on the whole show..just redoing King Of Snake as I wasnt happy with the source crossover points..think they're better now...won't be much longer

[markreed]

That was easily the best Underworld MkII show I saw (assuming the current lineup is MkIII)

[Badger]

Too right this show was just the pinnacle of UW Mk2 live.

Mark I don't mean to annoy you but any luck with that CD? We have finished the show now but if you have better versions of Cowgirl and what is now Ramajama (with Moaner lyrics) than our current ones (as they have some radio static compared to our other sources) we can remaster and easily splice those into the show.

[Badger]

The thing that might take me the rest of the day is going to be the info file on the work done for the show..lol. There will a fair few construction notes...

[Badger]

Yannick, Geoff, Markreed, you all have private messages. :-)